Modern Software Podcast logoThe New Relic Modern Software Podcast strives to address the most important topics in the software industry and present the most interesting perspectives. And our first episode of 2017 does just that as we welcome DevOps visionary Gene Kim.

A new Modern Software Podcast crew

In addition to talking DevOps with Gene, we’ve also got a discussion of the top software trends for 2017 with the re-formed Modern Software Podcast crew. Returnees include my co-host New Relic Developer Evangelist Tori Wieldt and our Vice President of Customer Analytics Todd Etchieson. The newcomers are Vice President of Engineering Belinda Runkle, Chief Architect Nic Benders, and acclaimed chili chef Clay Smith (he’s also a developer advocate).

The show focuses on the state of DevOps and how to measure its success, but we also delve into some predictions for 2017, including the ever-increasing use of the word “cyber,” and the surprising ways the rise of chatbots will affect software development [time code: 2:23].

DevOps technology and DevOps culture

To kick off the DevOps discussion, the podcast crew addresses the rising importance of containers in the battle for the hearts and minds of DevOps teams, and the huge cultural shift from “what is DevOps?” to “what’s the right way to do DevOps?” [7:20] (For more, check out the DevOps chat room on

The State of DevOps is good!

Things get even more interesting when Tori and I are joined by Gene Kim [12:33], founder of Tripwire and co-author of the seminal book The Phoenix Project: A Novel about IT, DevOps, and Helping Your Business Win. Gene also has a brand new book out, The DevOps Handbook: How to Create World-Class Agility, Reliability & Security in Technology Organizations, which takes the concepts introduced in The Phoenix Project and puts them into hands-on practice. Gene is no stranger to the New Relic blog, as we’ve covered his DevOps insights in multiple posts.

gene kim (1)

Gene shares a variety of his unique insights, including

  • DevOps is for any technology organization, not just so-called unicorns [13:09]
  • What kind of penetration has DevOps achieved so far? [13:43]
  • What kinds of big organizations are doing DevOps now? [14:59]
  • Who needs to care about DevOps? [15:33]
  • What are the biggest benefits of DevOps? [17:13]
  • What’s the difference between DevOps and NoOps—and why you need ops to do DevOps? [19:28]
  • What do people misunderstand about DevOps? [21:57]
  • The irony of how not crashing enough can make it hard to improve: [26:49]
  • How DevOps turns conventional wisdom on its head [28:53]
  • What are the key measurements of DevOps success? [29:36]
  • Speed vs. stability—you don’t have to choose! [32:31]
  • The one key to DevOps success [34:36]

New Relic was the host of the attached forum presented in the embedded podcast. However, the content and views expressed are those of the participants and do not necessarily reflect the views of New Relic. By hosting the podcast, New Relic does not necessarily adopt, guarantee, approve or endorse the information, views or products referenced therein.

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Note: The intro music for the Modern Software Podcast is courtesy of Audionautix'

Fredric Paul (aka The Freditor) is Editor in Chief for New Relic. He's an award-winning writer, editor, and content strategist who has held senior editorial positions at ReadWrite,, InformationWeek, CNET, Electronic Entertainment, PC World, and PC|Computing. His writing has appeared in MIT Technology Review, Omni, Conde Nast Traveler, and Newsweek, among other places. View posts by .

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